Zukes Canyon Open With Adoption?

[RARECJ8]

Zukes canyon starts by the new Keystone non-motorized trailhead, yeah, the one recently vandalized by graffiti. The USFS last year officially closed Zukes to motorized travel, since it falls along the SW corner of the non-motorized area. This closure came despite many decxades of 4x4 use in that gully. The trail itself is a moderate challenge and is similar to Bud, further over the ridge to the west, but w/out the massive final waterfall. Still, its a serious challenge for all but the most built rigs. Think harder than steve's loop, but less than Bud.

The USFS recently hinted they would consider reopening the trail to motorized traffic, however, they will only do so if they have in writing a signed volunteer agreement with a local club. In other words, they're looking for a club to 'adopt' the trail, remove the wrecked vehicle near the entrance, clean up the beer cans and bottles and otherwise make it nice. They will authorize 'adopted by...' signs, etc. The trail is but 1/2 mile from pavement and offers fantastic urban wheeling just like Bud, but again, not as difficuly, altho i recently walked it and its really chewed up-- no place for stockers. Saw a couple rattlers... total trail is same approx. length of Bud and the dream would to be having both open for diong a loop, etc.

So its a general open question, is R4x4 perhaps interested in assuming this trail? The hills angels have great success w/ adopting HLT, so maybe another group like R4x4 is interested in this opportunity? If not, we'll ask another group, but wanted to pitch the idea here 1st.

mb

[Denis]

I think it would be a good idea.

As, I've never done anything like this, I would look to you and Phil for some guidance. Perhaps, we can adopt both trails as they are close by and short. They are located close to town, so an after-work clean-up efforts are possible as well.



Zukes canyon starts by the new Keystone non-motorized trailhead, yeah, the one recently vandalized by graffiti. The USFS last year officially closed Zukes to motorized travel, since it falls along the SW corner of the non-motorized area. This closure came despite many decxades of 4x4 use in that gully. The trail itself is a moderate challenge and is similar to Bud, further over the ridge to the west, but w/out the massive final waterfall. Still, its a serious challenge for all but the most built rigs. Think harder than steve's loop, but less than Bud.

The USFS recently hinted they would consider reopening the trail to motorized traffic, however, they will only do so if they have in writing a signed volunteer agreement with a local club. In other words, they're looking for a club to 'adopt' the trail, remove the wrecked vehicle near the entrance, clean up the beer cans and bottles and otherwise make it nice. They will authorize 'adopted by...' signs, etc. The trail is but 1/2 mile from pavement and offers fantastic urban wheeling just like Bud, but again, not as difficuly, altho i recently walked it and its really chewed up-- no place for stockers. Saw a couple rattlers... total trail is same approx. length of Bud and the dream would to be having both open for diong a loop, etc.

So its a general open question, is R4x4 perhaps interested in assuming this trail? The hills angels have great success w/ adopting HLT, so maybe another group like R4x4 is interested in this opportunity? If not, we'll ask another group, but wanted to pitch the idea here 1st.

mb

[Sierra Valley]

I think we should try to adopt both trails, thats an excellent idea dennis.

[kairo]

Count me in :thumbsup:

[Rafterman]

I down with some clean up.:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :wave: :wave:

[Dirty Harry]

That would be wonderful. Kudos to Mark and Phil and the local wheeling community for having such a great relationship with the Forest Service. Unfortunately it is the exception, not the rule, but you guys have a great thing going in Reno and I think that this is an excellent opportunity. Zuk's is a fun canyon and I would love to see it reopened.

[christopher corpus]

count me in too. ill do some cleanup

[DBXJ]

hey im up for it and i'll try and get the days off when posted

[cagle]

I will help clean it up.:thumbsup:

[Washoe Wrangler]

:D A chance to open an area previously closed to offroading is RARE. Count me in. I will help with any resources available to me:thumbsup:

[drivnmf]

Hey, I'm always in for some clean-up especially if it re-opens a closed area....

[RARECJ8]

OK fellas... but adopting a trail is more than a one-time commitment-- they will ask for certain things, like maybe 100 man hours per year (easy if ya think about it) and one ot two annual, regular, organized clean-ups. Of course u'll be asked to 'patrol' the trail semi-regularly (who needs motive to go wheeling!) and likely help installing a bulletin board or two, plus installation and maintenance of the brown carsonite signs. It'll take a core dedicated group. We all know some wheelers that talk big and are always 'in' only to cxl at last minute. So if there is a for-sure attitude, I'll make the call and advise.

mb

[Connect]

I'm all for it, although I can't run them now I'd love to make sure they stay open for the future of wheelers in the Reno area.

We don't seem to have much of a problem getting members to clean up areas that we like (take MR cleanup and the HLT cleanup for examples) Although it was just me and Kevin on the HLT cleanup :roll:

[UrbnKrwlr]

you gotta get out of bed first, connect!!!

im down to help the clean up as long as i can get days off or help after work

[Connect]

I've been on more cleanup runs then ANYONE at R4x4 so keep talking :yes:

[EricsXJ]

Wow this is a rare opportunity and I will pitch in and help support any efforts to adopt this thing.

I've done Bud but never been to zuk's. Would definitely like to see it and wheel it once we get it open.

[kairo]

Wow this is a rare opportunity and I will pitch in and help support any efforts to adopt this thing.

I've done Bud but never been to zuk's. Would definitely like to see it and wheel it once we get it open.


No. Seeing Eric post on reno4x4--That's a rare opportunity ;)

[72 Virginians]

I'd like more info on how to go about adopting a trail.

[Reno Computer Repair]

So they want the junked cars pulled out??? FINE....
Then they need to be ready to let ALL the junked cars get dragged out.
I would ask them if they are still sticking to thier "not during high fire season rule".

So I am in for 1 hour a month. Just let me drag the old vehicles out :censor:

[xjmoser]

Im in!

:thumbsup:

[ChaseNme]

I will help with what ever I am capable of doing

[t wrecks]

I am in for sure. This is a great trail that is right in our backyard. I mourned the day I heard that it was going to be closed and I tried my best to give Phil the support to keep it from happening. Lets do what it takes get this run back!

[haleyanthony]

I'm new out here. I am going to try to do this pizza night thing tommorow night to meet some people. But my club that I was head of adopted a local trail back in NC from the rangers. It was a very rewarding experience and we cleaned it of litter 4 times a year and rode it often. I would support this as much as possible. It is a great way to network with the feds and help keep open existing trails and maybe as in this case reopen old or new trails. Count me in for any support I can give.
Haley

[ikrawl]

Didn't know the trail was closed. But I'm in to re-open that trail. Let me know when, I'll plan to be there.

[RARECJ8]

just got off the phone w/ the USFS folks and we have good news, bad and not so bad. first of all, the peavine management plan is now a valid legal document to govern activities on peavine. Bud Canyon is now an officially recognized travel route. This is a great victory. They ask whether a sign will do more harm than good at the entrance, which unless you know of its location, u'll drive right past it. A sign may invite lesser built 4x4s to get in there and the concern is resource damage from folks turning out up the hillside face, thus causing 'resource damage'. My suggestion was to leave it as is.

comments?

They will need help removing the abandoned cars that litter the non-motorized area just above keystone. They have an auto wrecking business that will remove the hulks, but they need to be hauled/chained from their location down to the edge of leadership parkway. RHG and others are hot to do this, but we MUST wait until after the fire restrictions are lifted. They are so close to the raod we can even likely do this w/ snow on the ground. So this sounds like a fall project.

comments?

The recent peavine fire left federal lands scorched and i suggested perhaps some way to help re-seed the burned areas. Of all the fire, only 7% is federal (aka public), the rest being private inholdings. He will get back to me about ideas. He suggested each rig be given several sacks of seed and start at the top and spread the seeds as one drives downhill. Or we can also get out and walk some of the area scattering the seeds. We MUST invite the sierra Club on this one, because...


Zukes Canyon.

There is some resistance from non-motorized users to legally (re) open the trail. As of today, its illegal to drive the trail and he said they have in fact recently issued citations to some quads driving the trail. That's gunna hurt the wallet! He suggested the way to reopen Zukes is:

Get the blessings of the other multi-user groups. I'm confident the mountain bike groups will support the plan. They will receive over 25 miles of non-motor single track on peavine and will be needing logistical assistance to get the trails built, etc. The bikers (and sierra club) and of course WE want the wrecked cars removed. This shows we care... If they give up that slice of the no-motor area, (Zukes) there must be some consideration, like helping them haul logs, upgrading and building trails, etc. in evans canyon and the other bike trail areas. This will take some smooth talking and i have the contacts to pitch the idea to the bikes, but no idea about the sierra club. This is where the seeding idea was suggested... clever, huh? Any other trail users we can think of to invite/negotiate with? Maybe the neighborhood advisory board for the adjoining area. We can get this on their agenda easy enough, but i'd rather approach them AFTER some car reomval and we'll bring a power point show to demonstrate our efforts. ideas?

Their persepective is if enough of the multi trail users agree, then Zukes is a GO! Then adoption, etc will follow. I goofed and didn't inquire about adoption of Bud, but since its an official travel route, that should not be a problem.

comments?

Perhaps next pizza meeting we can explore these ideas in more detail? Shoud the USFS guy be invited-- of course we can pitch in for his pizza...


mb

[Washoe Wrangler]

That sounds like a good approach:thumbsup: keep us informed.

[72 Virginians]

Good work Mark!

I'm sure there's enough of us here who care enough to spend a few weekends a year to maintain the land. I'm down for Sunday cleanups, repairs, etc.

Keep us up to date.

[Denis]

A sign may invite lesser built 4x4s to get in there and the concern is resource damage from folks turning out up the hillside face, thus causing 'resource damage'. My suggestion was to leave it as is.

comments?

perhaps a sign can be put in a little further up the trail, before the first waterfall. maybe stating the difficulty of the trail and who adopted it.

[t wrecks]

I agree with keeping Bud as discreet as possible. If the adopting club wants signage, then why not halfway through or at the end? Also, not that it matters but Bud canyon is a lame name, never liked it.

Removing the cars is easy, but one thing. Someone did this on the Red Rock side of Peavine and while dragging the cars they left a trail of car parts the whole way out. Good deed, bad execution.

I would be surprised if anyone from the nonmotorized community would consider reopening a closed area. Lets hope that they are more flexible than the equestrian folks, I have had nothing but sour interactions with them while on the trail.

[72 Virginians]

That's odd. I've encountered the equestrian folks a few times this year and they've been nothing but cool. A couple of them even gave me directions to some nice spur trails the first time I was in the Jumbo area.

Maybe I haven't had my first sour encounter yet.

[MIGHTYRAM97]

:rolleyes: Maybe it depends on your rig's shoe size, and if it's all beat up ?? :sick: People are wierd like that... Especially tree huggers and enviro nazi's:eek: ... If your rig is runnin huge shoes and looks like it's been driven by Hellen Keller:nervous: , They might think you're out to trash the trail or surrounding hillsides:eek: .....but if you show up in a mild lifted DD with no larger than average/average tread design then it shows you're responsible, and not out to tear stuff up...:thumbsup:

Not everybody is into hardcore rigs and not everyone understands where the 4x4 community is comming from... I have encountered many a horseback riders with my rig (the RAM) and they were always friendly, that's the rig I use as a daily driver and hunting rig...I bet if I rolled up on the same people with my K5 and had loud exhaust, I bet it'd scare the bejesus out of their horses and they'd be pissed...:censor: Just a thought of why they might be upset...(tree huggers are the worst since most of them complain about vechiles and yet most of them drive to earthday (huh :rolleyes: go figure)

[MIGHTYRAM97]

just got off the phone w/ the USFS folks and we have good news, bad and not so bad. first of all, the peavine management plan is now a valid legal document to govern activities on peavine. Bud Canyon is now an officially recognized travel route. This is a great victory. They ask whether a sign will do more harm than good at the entrance, which unless you know of its location, u'll drive right past it. A sign may invite lesser built 4x4s to get in there and the concern is resource damage from folks turning out up the hillside face, thus causing 'resource damage'. My suggestion was to leave it as is.

comments?

They will need help removing the abandoned cars that litter the non-motorized area just above keystone. They have an auto wrecking business that will remove the hulks, but they need to be hauled/chained from their location down to the edge of leadership parkway. RHG and others are hot to do this, but we MUST wait until after the fire restrictions are lifted. They are so close to the raod we can even likely do this w/ snow on the ground. So this sounds like a fall project.

comments?

The recent peavine fire left federal lands scorched and i suggested perhaps some way to help re-seed the burned areas. Of all the fire, only 7% is federal (aka public), the rest being private inholdings. He will get back to me about ideas. He suggested each rig be given several sacks of seed and start at the top and spread the seeds as one drives downhill. Or we can also get out and walk some of the area scattering the seeds. We MUST invite the sierra Club on this one, because...


Zukes Canyon.

There is some resistance from non-motorized users to legally (re) open the trail. As of today, its illegal to drive the trail and he said they have in fact recently issued citations to some quads driving the trail. That's gunna hurt the wallet! He suggested the way to reopen Zukes is:

Get the blessings of the other multi-user groups. I'm confident the mountain bike groups will support the plan. They will receive over 25 miles of non-motor single track on peavine and will be needing logistical assistance to get the trails built, etc. The bikers (and sierra club) and of course WE want the wrecked cars removed. This shows we care... If they give up that slice of the no-motor area, (Zukes) there must be some consideration, like helping them haul logs, upgrading and building trails, etc. in evans canyon and the other bike trail areas. This will take some smooth talking and i have the contacts to pitch the idea to the bikes, but no idea about the sierra club. This is where the seeding idea was suggested... clever, huh? Any other trail users we can think of to invite/negotiate with? Maybe the neighborhood advisory board for the adjoining area. We can get this on their agenda easy enough, but i'd rather approach them AFTER some car reomval and we'll bring a power point show to demonstrate our efforts. ideas?

Their persepective is if enough of the multi trail users agree, then Zukes is a GO! Then adoption, etc will follow. I goofed and didn't inquire about adoption of Bud, but since its an official travel route, that should not be a problem.

comments?

Perhaps next pizza meeting we can explore these ideas in more detail? Shoud the USFS guy be invited-- of course we can pitch in for his pizza...


mb


Mark You DA MAN !!!:thumbsup:

[72 Virginians]

:rolleyes: Maybe it depends on your rig's shoe size, and if it's all beat up ?? :sick: People are wierd like that... Especially tree huggers and enviro nazi's:eek: ... If your rig is runnin huge shoes and looks like it's been driven by Hellen Keller:nervous: , They might think you're out to trash the trail or surrounding hillsides:eek: .....but if you show up in a mild lifted DD with no larger than average/average tread design then it shows you're responsible, and not out to tear stuff up...:thumbsup:

Not everybody is into hardcore rigs and not everyone understands where the 4x4 community is comming from... I have encountered many a horseback riders with my rig (the RAM) and they were always friendly, that's the rig I use as a daily driver and hunting rig...I bet if I rolled up on the same people with my K5 and had loud exhaust, I bet it'd scare the bejesus out of their horses and they'd be pissed...:censor: Just a thought of why they might be upset...(tree huggers are the worst since most of them complain about vechiles and yet most of them drive to earthday (huh :rolleyes: go figure)

Good point. Both Jeeps look pretty clean (relatively). I guess some of the stickers on the XJ make em laugh.
But, for the most part, I try to give the horse and mtn bike riders their space. The trails don't belong solely to the off-roaders. It would be cool if the tree huggers felt the same way.

[RARECJ8]

last year after Sierra Trek we left via Bowman Res. out toward Hwy. 20, then 80 east to Reno. Along the way we came upon, of all things, a cattle drive. Right on the forested dirt road overlooking sierra buttes! An advance cowgirl (hot!) rode up and requested we stop driving and turn off the motor. Soon a heard of unhappy cows ambled along and passed my truck. That was quite the experience-- they rubbing against the truck, rocking it side to side as the 60 something head passed by. Once they cleared after 20 minutes or so, the other mounted herders passed and thanked us for our patience, understanding and cooperation. Well, of course...

When encountering equesterians it's suggested a motorized rig stop, pull to the side and shut down the motor. Look to the mounted rider for signals whether to wait or go on. Same goes for, and this is nevada... sheep. Once crossing from Big Creek to Kingston, we came upon a large sheep drive. (Hey SV: Daaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaddddddy!) As with all other trail users, we reflect our side of the equation by our actions, conduct and how such are projected upon others.

OK, off soapbox.

mb

[Reno Computer Repair]

Sounds good.

Larry Anderson (USFS) called me Thursday, I asked about the Peavine car removal again, and sometime in October might work out.
Also he is sending me some information on what he called the Martis Plan, I will post it up once I get it.

We can make sure to have a tail rig follow behind when dragging the vehicles out, they can pickup any parts that rattle free.

The powerpoint presentation sounds GREAT. Before/After/During...great pics.

On another day AFTER the car removal we can have the Sierra Club "buddy up", ride shotgun chauferred in our rigs to help spread the seed.

For this to really work out, we need to get those done with a show of force.
Not like the 12 people out of 40 that showed up at the last Peavine cleanup.

Over 300 showed up for the Rockape/Shaffer Moonrocks challenge, is it to much to ask for 60 for this??? We may not need that many, but the sh!t will get done faster, which leads to fun wheeling & dinner faster!
Again, I will buy dinner for all that want.......hell even the first drink!

[RARECJ8]

better hope u had a good tip week, 'cause we're going to accept that offer RHG. Or is it GSG? Blind Onion is right there, kings row/mccarran) and is quite good. Oh and i have 2 for 1 pizza vouchers. Sorry PJ.

mb

[72 Virginians]

better hope u had a good tip week, 'cause we're going to accept that offer RHG. Or is it GSG? Blind Onion is right there, kings row/mccarran) and is quite good. Oh and i have 2 for 1 pizza vouchers. Sorry PJ.

mb

Blind Onion :rock:

Are you gonna schedule a 2 day event in Oct?
I can definitly show up on a Sunday. I can donate the services of my winch if I can ever get the cable unbound.

[Reno Computer Repair]

Probably a two day even again in October.

Buying everyone pizza is no problem...remember I work 80 hours a week:spike:

Now if we all went to Rapscallions or Bela Serra, that could make me scream uncle.....

[t wrecks]

:rolleyes: Maybe it depends on your rig's shoe size, and if it's all beat up ?? :sick: People are wierd like that... Especially tree huggers and enviro nazi's:eek: ... If your rig is runnin huge shoes and looks like it's been driven by Hellen Keller:nervous: , They might think you're out to trash the trail or surrounding hillsides:eek: .....but if you show up in a mild lifted DD with no larger than average/average tread design then it shows you're responsible, and not out to tear stuff up...:thumbsup:

Not everybody is into hardcore rigs and not everyone understands where the 4x4 community is comming from... I have encountered many a horseback riders with my rig (the RAM) and they were always friendly, that's the rig I use as a daily driver and hunting rig...I bet if I rolled up on the same people with my K5 and had loud exhaust, I bet it'd scare the bejesus out of their horses and they'd be pissed...:censor: Just a thought of why they might be upset...(tree huggers are the worst since most of them complain about vechiles and yet most of them drive to earthday (huh :rolleyes: go figure)

Yeah, my rig isnt exactly pretty, but I dont think that is a reason to give a guy a hard time:D! As for trail etiquette around horses, I have always been considerate in being quiet and giving them the right of way. My wife owned a horse and she taught me how to ride so I know whats expected. I guess my experiences struck me deep because both times we were very conscious of giving them space but they already, (both times were women) had a bad attitude about us being there. I like horses and I like people that ride them. I dont like to be judged because of the activities that I enjoy.

I will continue to be curtious to others on the trail no matter what my past experiences are, just because thats the way I would want to be treated.

[72 Virginians]

That's a good attitude to have, man.

[haleyanthony]

Work schedule permiting I'll be there. I recomend from past experience in North Carolina to invite the Rangers to every meeting. Get there input. Act on there requests for assistance quicky promptly and in force and they will in turn help you in everyway possible. One thing that we tried in North Carolina that should help out here Was a town hall type meeting between all the user groups. We were lucky enough to have organized clubs representing each user groups and limited it to 3 people from each club. but the forrest service was able to put out there vision and each group was able to put out there hopes and wishes. All of the trails wether hiking, biking, equestrian, Atv or 4x4 was adopted by a club. It worked out great. We found we were all likeable people and wanted the same things. We then had to send a message to the rouge users. In North Carolina it was Mostly off the trail riding by Atv users. It was causing a ton of errosion damage. We started carrying the rangers in our jeeps. When they spotted the off trail use theyed pop out and write very expensive citations. It helped some. But we definetly became part of the solution and that is the answer to keeping the trails open. I don't think I've met you Mark but I'm looking forward to it.
Haley

[Dirty Harry]

Haley it sounds like you guys had a great relationship with the Forest Service out there. That is rare, but we are fortunate to have a similar relationship here in Reno. There is an organization called the Washoe County Backcountry Coalition that is made up of representatives of Jeep, equestrian, mountain bike, hiking, and motorcycle groups that get together amongst themselves to formulate a consensus on issues to present to the forest service. Unchecked development has been the biggest issue we are facing in Reno.