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Thread: Another bailout coming?

  1. #1
    Web Wheeler
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    Another bailout coming?

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/louiswoo...kruptcy-again/

    I'm hoping the government can send out the $300 checks like last time as well. Giving money to people who don't know how to spend it ALWAYS worked in the past.


    I'm glad I bought stock in Ford.
    Quote Originally Posted by bdevr View Post
    Wow, this thread is like a ping pong match with 8 players on an octagonal table. Pointless and dizzying...

  2. #2
    Wheeler
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    The author of this story is saying Obama is responsible for the GM bailout. That is not true. GM was bailed out under the TARP plan in October 2008, and January 2009.
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trouble...Relief_Program
    Point is: The piece is biased to a political agenda. Politics sucks in America, and has become way to divisive. My dad always said, believe nothing of what you hear and half of what you see. Turns out, dad was awful close to being right.
    Funny though, I've always had Chevy toys, but drove Ford trucks. Not one more GM product for me.

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  4. #3
    Web Wheeler
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    With Republicans controlling the House, another bailout will never happen.


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  5. #4
    Wheeler
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    33 Republicans voted for TARP in the Senate that GW Bush signed:
    http://www.senate.gov/legislative/LI...n=2&vote=00212
    91 Republican members of the House voted for TARP that GW Bush signed:
    http://clerk.house.gov/evs/2008/roll681.xml
    I know, but Rush Limbaugh said not one Republican voted for it? See what my dad said above!
    The truth will set you free.

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  7. #5
    Web Wheeler
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    Our Founding Fathers got it right with Separation of Church and State (although not necessarily adhered to these days...) but too bad they did not have the foresight to predict a need for the SEPARATION of CORPORATION AND STATE. Super PACs, corporate donations, lobbyists.... it all makes me sick. At what point did our decide that business would be the deciding factor in who runs our country and what decisions are made? I understand that business is owned and operated by citizens of this country, but the fact that say the Koch brothers, 2 people, can have more influence over our government than 100,000's of citizens because they have deep pockets is pretty screwed up. Not to say they shouldn't have a voice, but when corporate contributions are swaying the vote, someone should be intervening.
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  8. #6
    Web Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by MrWillys View Post
    3
    The truth will set you free.
    Amen brother!

    Republicans, Democrats, they're all the same... Big Business, the deepest pockets, runs our country, not the voice of the people...
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  10. #7
    Wheeler
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    I'm with Reeves!

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  12. #8
    Web Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reeves View Post
    Our Founding Fathers got it right with Separation of Church and State (although not necessarily adhered to these days...) but too bad they did not have the foresight to predict a need for the SEPARATION of CORPORATION AND STATE. Super PACs, corporate donations, lobbyists.... it all makes me sick. At what point did our decide that business would be the deciding factor in who runs our country and what decisions are made? I understand that business is owned and operated by citizens of this country, but the fact that say the Koch brothers, 2 people, can have more influence over our government than 100,000's of citizens because they have deep pockets is pretty screwed up. Not to say they shouldn't have a voice, but when corporate contributions are swaying the vote, someone should be intervening.
    Where in the constitution or any founding document does it say anything about separation of church and state?

  13. #9
    Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by flighht2k5 View Post
    Where in the constitution or any founding document does it say anything about separation of church and state?
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Separat...urch_and_state

  14. #10
    Web Wheeler
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    Sweet Wikipedia. Why don't you go read it for yourself.

  15. #11
    Web Wheeler
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    Paul Ryan voted for TARP
    Quote Originally Posted by bdevr View Post
    Wow, this thread is like a ping pong match with 8 players on an octagonal table. Pointless and dizzying...

  16. #12
    Web Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by flighht2k5 View Post
    Where in the constitution or any founding document does it say anything about separation of church and state?
    I think I found the guy who ditched history every day.
    Quote Originally Posted by bdevr View Post
    Wow, this thread is like a ping pong match with 8 players on an octagonal table. Pointless and dizzying...

  17. #13
    cjc143c
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  18. #14
    Web Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by DirtyChemist View Post
    I think I found the guy who ditched history every day.
    Prove me wrong crazy. Quote a founding document and show me.

  19. #15
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    The constitution states, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." Both the free exercise clause and the establishment clause place restrictions on the government concerning laws they pass or interfering with religion. No restrictions are placed on religions except perhaps that a religious denomination cannot become the state religion.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Durtywrench
    Some days I wish my mom would have swallowed too.
    Quote Originally Posted by Dylan(Deluxx) View Post
    I'm not sure what the tranny ratios are, but i can leave it in first-low-low and go take a $hit and come outside and it will still be on my driveway crawling.
    Quote Originally Posted by The Most Interesting Man in the World
    Chuck Norris invented black. In fact, he invented the entire spectrum of visible light, except pink. Tom Cruise invented pink.

  21. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by PhantomRage View Post
    The constitution states, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof." Both the free exercise clause and the establishment clause place restrictions on the government concerning laws they pass or interfering with religion. No restrictions are placed on religions except perhaps that a religious denomination cannot become the state religion.
    Thank you . The term comes from a letter Thomas Jefferson wrote in response to the Danbury Baptists when they showed fear that the govt in the future may restrict free exercise. And Jefferson wrote back there is a separation of church and state. But he didn't mean that church would not influence the state but that the state would not run the church.

  22. #18
    Web Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by flighht2k5 View Post
    Where in the constitution or any founding document does it say anything about separation of church and state?


    Quote Originally Posted by flighht2k5 View Post
    Thank you . The term comes from a letter Thomas Jefferson wrote in response to the Danbury Baptists when they showed fear that the govt in the future may restrict free exercise. And Jefferson wrote back there is a separation of church and state. But he didn't mean that church would not influence the state but that the state would not run the church.
    I love it, another reno4x4 thread derailment...

    At no point did I say it was a quote. Its been interpreted as such from statements made by TJ in the letter you referenced, in addition to statements in the Constitution, Article 6 and the 1st Amendment (Bill of Rights) and held up by the Supreme Court a few times since.

    My point is the Constitution states "We the PEOPLE" NOT "We the BP Oil" or "We the Super PAC" or "We the Koch brothers" or "We the church" (that one is just for you :-)

    ...but seems the way we've been going it's okay to let Big Business and better margins dictate the decision process, not what's best for the people. Government should be there to support capitalism and free trade for all, not for a select few or at the cost of many.
    Last edited by Reeves; August 16th, 2012 at 11:20 PM.
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  23. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reeves View Post
    Our Founding Fathers got it right with Separation of Church and State (although not necessarily adhered to these days...) but too bad they did not have the foresight to predict a need for the SEPARATION of CORPORATION AND STATE. Super PACs, corporate donations, lobbyists.... it all makes me sick. At what point did our decide that business would be the deciding factor in who runs our country and what decisions are made? I understand that business is owned and operated by citizens of this country, but the fact that say the Koch brothers, 2 people, can have more influence over our government than 100,000's of citizens because they have deep pockets is pretty screwed up. Not to say they shouldn't have a voice, but when corporate contributions are swaying the vote, someone should be intervening.
    And to support the other side, what about George Soro's? They will spend more this year on the election than the GDP of most small countries.
    The part that gets me is that they bailed out banks and corps and now they're going to slash benefits for the people. I don't mean welfare, or that crap. I mean the social security, and medicare that I've paid into my whole life. What needs to be stopped is the lobbyist. How about a lobbyist for the working class?

  24. #20
    Web Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by Reeves View Post
    I love it, another reno4x4 thread derailment...

    At no point did I say it was a quote. Its been interpreted as such from statements made by TJ in the letter you referenced, in addition to statements in the Constitution, Article 6 and the 1st Amendment (Bill of Rights) and held up by the Supreme Court a few times since.

    My point is the Constitution states "We the PEOPLE" NOT "We the BP Oil" or "We the Super PAC" or "We the Koch brothers" or "We the church" (that one is just for you :-)

    ...but seems the way we've been going it's okay to let Big Business and better margins dictate the decision process, not what's best for the people. Government should be there to support capitalism and free trade for all, not for a select few or at the cost of many.
    The reason it was derailed is because people like you who spew out in-correct information they hear from someone else and they refuse to actually research it.

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  26. #21
    Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by flighht2k5 View Post
    The reason it was derailed is because people like you who spew out in-correct information they hear from someone else and they refuse to actually research it.
    Please, feel free to tie together how the separation of Church & State applies to thread topic?

  27. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by flighht2k5 View Post
    The reason it was derailed is because people like you who spew out in-correct information they hear from someone else and they refuse to actually research it.
    “The trick is in what one emphasizes. We either make ourselves miserable, or we make ourselves strong. The amount of work is the same.” -Carlos Castaneda

  28. #23
    Web Wheeler
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    Quote Originally Posted by flighht2k5 View Post
    The reason it was derailed is because people like you who spew out in-correct information they hear from someone else and they refuse to actually research it.
    Wow, you are truly a piece of work. I don't get what you are trying to prove here. I guess if we're going to go off topic let's do it with gusto...

    1. You yourself said "And Jefferson wrote back there is a separation of church and state. But he didn't mean that church would not influence the state but that the state would not run the church."

    Uhhhh. Is that not still a separation of church and state? TJ said it, you even agreed, so what incorrect information did I spew. you just want to argue he meant keep gov out of religion and not vice versa. I never made a position for one way or the other, just that there is a separation.

    2. The only thing I said was "Our Founding Fathers got it right with Separation of Church and State (although not necessarily adhered to these days...)"

    What I believe you took from this, based on your rant, is that I meant Religion should stay our of Gov. Thing is guy, as noted above in item #1, I never took a position, lower your blood pressure and reread the statement. I just stated that our founding fathers saw the need for a separation between the 2 and related that to how we should have the same in business.

    3. From what I can gather from your "I'm smarter than you posts", is that you want to argue that the Founding Fathers only wanted the gov out of church but not vice versa. No one is making that point, but if you want to argue it, go start your own thread. I'll meet you there and we can go at it there regarding Religion's place in government.

    Or I guess you could be just be trying to prove that I was incorrect in a statement that I never made.

    4. The only other thing I can really gather from this is you went on an off topic rant to prove to the internet that you knew where the term came from. You made a claim that I stated it was quoted in a Constitution document, which at no point I did. You incorrectly quoted me, then proved that statement that I never made wrong.

    uhhh, good job I guess. I'll go get a gold star for you.

    5. When I first read your initial post I was thinking Name:  images (1).jpg
Views: 160
Size:  11.6 KB. But then I was like, well maybe I mis-interpreted his demeanor and changed my line of thinking to Name:  images (2).jpg
Views: 183
Size:  9.7 KB. You know how things are easily misinterpreted when typed on the internet. Ok, cool, here's a little bit of American history Name:  images (3).jpg
Views: 186
Size:  13.6 KB . For the Yellow piece of the pie "Where in the constitution or any founding document does it say anything about separation of church and state?"

    But I think I gave you too much credit and back to my original position...
    Last edited by Reeves; August 17th, 2012 at 11:51 AM.
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  29. #24
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    Wow, this thread is like a ping pong match with 8 players on an octagonal table. Pointless and dizzying...

    If you are truly the "working" class, then nobody in Washington is really looking out for you. Your only voice is your vote. Use it for whichever party you think will hurt you less. If you've paid into the system either party is going to take that money and redistribute it to someone else. Make no mistake about one thing though: this country has always and will always have it's upper and lower classes. The rich will ALWAYS have more say than the poor. That my friends is an undeniable fact of life.

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  31. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by bdevr View Post
    Wow, this thread is like a ping pong match with 8 players on an octagonal table. Pointless and dizzying...
    And this is why I have begun to really hate reno4x4...I apologize for the inadvertent thread jack. Surely didn't mean for my comments to take us in this direction.

    Quote Originally Posted by bdevr View Post
    If you are truly the "working" class, then nobody in Washington is really looking out for you. Your only voice is your vote. Use it for whichever party you think will hurt you less. If you've paid into the system either party is going to take that money and redistribute it to someone else. Make no mistake about one thing though: this country has always and will always have it's upper and lower classes. The rich will ALWAYS have more say than the poor. That my friends is an undeniable fact of life.
    Thanks for making a comment that actually has relevance to the thread topic :-) Agreed 100%
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